Here:
best news of all is that the initial production will be for individuals, not corporations.
3 Likes
And the bad news is that it needs a special PSU.
I know it looks like a USB-C port, they even waffle about USB PD supportā¦ but that just means you can plug it into a fast charger without blowing it up. It cannot negotiate any high power PD modes, there is no onboard power regulator, it is 5v max.
The PSU for this is a proprietary one delivering 5v, 5A. Referred to as a ācustomā mode in their specs.
Big pass.
1 Like
priced only $5 more than the 4GB rPi4B+ so I have a feeling there will be lots of initial testers helping to evaluate the product before the corporations are allowed onboard.
BTW, it will run with a 5V,3A PS but with that it will limit USB output power to 600mA and itāll throttle the CPU back if you want to get more performance.
1 Like
Thatās two releases in a row where they have flubbed the power supply. I think the original rPi 4 was worse with their confusion about how resistors work; not sure how you make that mistake and still otherwise successfully pull off a working board.
Wish theyād start doing USB-C right.
2 Likes
To add to thatā¦ it has two micro-hdmi socketsā¦ a better option would be to replace one of them with a usb c port supporting passthrough video. Even better would be that, and also using a full size hdmi socketā¦
1 Like
Oh dearā¦ no no no no no
- That looks like extortion
- if you do not buy their āfauxā USB-C PD charger with its ācustom modeā they will cripple your machine.
I wonder if this also happens if you power it via the gpio header.
I expect third-party adapters with cables to become available. Itās one of those āok itās technically allowed in the standard, but good luck finding hardware right nowā things, but Iām sure this will change. I donāt think itās proprietary in any way, just an unusual design choice. I donāt see any indication that itās faux; I just think itās unusual.
Maybe a more flexible PMIC just ran them over their target cost, and they decided that 5V @ 3A for most uses, and 5A if you want to not use a powered USB hub, was a reasonable trade-off.
Thereās some good conversation in this thread:
2 Likes
I think itās more like if you donāt provide it with enough power, they limit the output power the USB ports will provide which is supposed to be enough for IO like keyboards/mice so that the board keeps running.
All this USB-C dance-around sounds like there are licensing issues they donāt want to pay or they really need a senior EE designer to clean up the mess.
1 Like
Well, not supporting 9V or 12V means cheaper PMIC and probably fewer passives ā likely also fewer inductors I think. And you can see the space on the board dedicated to power management.
But Iām still annoyed that even a cheap phone can take 9V and somehow they didnāt manage to find room on the board or in the budget for more flexible PD options.
I donāt think there would be any additional licensing costs to that ā do you have a source for that suggestion?
1 Like
The source is just a random thought that a more complex interface chip would be another license fee.
But from what I gathered, they are likely already paying the $5,000 /yr fee to joiin USB IF or and that seems enough. Also read an Ankler thread discussing why USB-C PD system were so much more expensive and it noted chip count to implement is a few $$ more because of the complexities of USB PD. The added dollars to implement on a ~$15 assembly(25% of $60) are significant at retail.
They are already using USB-C PD, is my understanding. Itās just that they are only set to negotiate 5V; their regulator stage isnāt set up to handle 9V, 12V, or 20V. Therefore, they need 5A for all the power needs, and the supply has to be willing to negotiate supplying 5V at 5A (few do, it seems, even though I believe itās covered in the spec) and the cable has to be tagged for 5A.
So they really pushed the costs of handling many voltages on the board over to the added costs in the power supply which is pushing more current at 5V. AND if there are not many 5V/5A USB-C power supplies that move also drive sales up of their PSU as Owen pointed out.
1 Like
Which, for the vast majority of loads that donāt need to supply lots of downstream USB current, could reasonably be expected to result in a lower mean total cost of acquisition. Many existing power supplies will be completely adequate for I suspect almost everyoneā¦
I donāt think itās necessary to assume malicious intent, even if I disagree with either an engineering or business decision here. Unlike last time we donāt even need to assume a rather naĆÆve mistake. I can disagree with the choice but recognize that the choice could be rational and not malicious.
Edit: I got a little lost in all the noise about it. From the page in the OP:
So itās a custom design supporting eight power domains of at least three voltages (5V, 3.3V, and 1.8V) and probably more, and they still didnāt include the ability to handle higher voltage supply. 